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April 4, 2000
QuestChat with Dale Satran

Aerospace Engineer
NASA Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA

Tue Apr 4 11:14:27 2000

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 2 - 09:30:42 ]
Hello to our early arriving chat participants. Today's Aerospace Team Online chat with Dale Satran from NASA Ames Research Center will begin in about 30 minutes. Be sure you have read Dale's profile at http://quest.nasa.gov/aero/team/satran.html to prepare your questions.

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 3 - 09:32:19 ]
At the conclusion of today's chat, be sure to send us your comments by visiting our NASA QuestChat Information Center, at http://quest.nasa.gov/qchats. We look forward to hearing from you!

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 5 - 10:03:02 ]
Hello and welcome to today's NASA Quest Aerospace Team Online chat with Dale Satran from NASA Ames Research Center.

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 6 - 10:03:18 ]
Since 1993, Dale Satran has been responsible for guiding a team involved in the high lift research program. The team develops new tools for industry to use in designing high lift systems on commercial transports.

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 7 - 10:03:34 ]
And now, here is Dale Satran to answer your questions.

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 10 - 10:07:28 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] Hello 2 students form Faubion Middle School in Mckinney, Texas we are here to chat with you
Welcome, Chris and David. We've posted your first question for Dale Satran, and are awaiting his response. Thank you for joining us today!

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 11 - 10:07:38 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion] what is the difference between aerospace and aeronautical engineering?
Aeronautical engineering refers to aircraft while aerospace engineering considers space craft as well as aircraft.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 12 - 10:08:03 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] Hello 2 students form Faubion Middle School in Mckinney, Texas we are here to chat with you

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 16 - 10:10:21 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] hello we are 3 students from dowell middle school in McKinney,Tx.
How are you doing?

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 17 - 10:10:36 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] hello we are 3 students from dowell middle school in McKinney,Tx.
Welcome Dowell students. Dale Satran is ready for your questions.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 20 - 10:12:54 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] what are differences in high speed and low speed vehicles?
It depends on how we define high speed. Do you want to define high speed as greater than the speed of sound?

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 21 - 10:13:27 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] We are doing very well and are interested in the mechanics of flight.
Any thing specific regarding the mechanics of flight?

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 25 - 10:15:23 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] do you have any experience with ultralights?
When I was in college, I tried my hand at hang gliders. Our student chapter of AIAA built a hang glider. The glider had very low performance so we didn't get much flight time. I have never been involved with an ultralight.

[ ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool - 26 - 10:16:29 ]
Chris has much experience with ultralights

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 28 - 10:17:18 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] yes greater than the speed of sound
As an aircraft approaches the speed of sound, the aerodynamics of the vehicle change substantial. To improve the characteristics and performance of the vehicle the wings are swept back at greater angles for high speed vehicles over low speed vehicles.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 29 - 10:19:00 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] yes, especially how lift is created.
Due to the airfoil shape of the wing as air flows over the wing the air on the upper surface is accelerated. This acceleration causes a reduction in pressure due to the Bernoulli principle. The reduction in pressure lifts the wing creating the lift for the aircraft.

[ Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool - 32 - 10:21:15 ]
we are doing a project for school that envolves us making a airplane out of house-hold items. we can use anything that is not paper like straws, plastic bags, and bottles.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 34 - 10:21:52 ]
RE: [DowellAlphaStudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] What exactly is an ultralight.
My definition of an ultralight is a small aircraft that typically carries one pilot. The vehicle is very light weight and can be disassembled easily. An ultralight has a small engine.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 38 - 10:24:27 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] We are having a model non-paper airplane contest. any suggestions?
If you use, straws as your structural members and plastic bags as your wing skins, you should be able to make a model airplane that has no paper. Good luck.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 39 - 10:24:53 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] an ultralight is lawn furniture with wings.
That is an interesting definition as well

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 42 - 10:26:24 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] by the way Faubion and Dowell are rival schools nothing serious just competition
We're glad both schools are online in the spirit of competition to chat with Dale Satran. Good luck to both!

[ DowellAlphaStudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool - 43 - 10:26:57 ]
The Non-paper airplane was actually Dowells idea,not Faubion's.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 44 - 10:27:33 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] how do forward swept wings effect lift and high speed flight?
Forward swept wings are efficient at high speed flight but they are structurally unstable. It was very difficult to build a forward swept wing that was strong enough but light enough for flight. With the advances in composite materials, the capabilities of a forward swept wing has been demonstrated by the research vehicle, X-29.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 46 - 10:29:51 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] what could we use for the wing supports?
Plastic straws and plastic bags might work. If you can't find stiff straws, you could use balsa wood.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 48 - 10:32:04 ]
RE: [DowellAlphaStudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] Would the plastic bags work better if they were stretched tight or if they were loose and created a pocket for the air?
In most cases, the plastic bag should probably be stretched but you might have a design that would work with the bag loose also. The wing might work like a parasail does then.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 50 - 10:33:53 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] What else is unique about the X model planes and have you had any experience with the (David's favorite plane is the X-15 mach 6.72 about 300,000 ft. in the air)
Every X vehicle that NASA has built was exploring new boundaries in aerospace research. I have never worked with any of the X vehicles during my career. The X-15 was a cool aircraft.

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 52 - 10:34:58 ]
Everyone, you're asking excellent questions today! Don't forget to send us your comments about today's chat at http://quest.nasa.gov/qchats.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 54 - 10:35:38 ]
RE: [DowellAlphaStudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] The object of the competition is to have a plane that goes the farthest, so would having a loose bag create more drag and cause it to float down?
How are the models being propelled? Hand launch? If the goal is the greatest distance, I would agree that the bag should be tight to minimize the drag of your model.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 57 - 10:38:30 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] do you have any experience with very "unusually" shaped or designed aircraft
The current vehicle that I am working with is a Blended Wing Body, which is being studied as a future passenger transport. This vehicle looks like a flying wing. Passengers would be riding inside the wing since there isn't a fuselage.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 58 - 10:40:43 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] What do you enjoy working on the most aircraft or spacecraft
I have never worked on a spacecraft. My experience is primarily low speed aerodynamics. It is often very difficult to design high speed vehicles that also have good low speed characteristics but high speed vehicles have to land and no one wants to land at high speeds.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 63 - 10:43:50 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] what other supports could we use that could be found around the house
If you still have Tinker Toys or something comparable, the sticks could also be used for structure. I am sure there are other things but I can't think of anything else at this moment.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 64 - 10:44:40 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] have you ever worked on a VTOL aircraft?
No. Although we studied them in college.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 65 - 10:45:45 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] which astronaut did you get to ride with to the space shuttle
I have never riden in the space shuttle so I am confused by your question.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 66 - 10:47:10 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] what range do you concider low speed?
I think of low speed as 0 to 200 mph for aircraft. Medium speed is from 200 mph to 600 mph. High speed is from 600 mph to 22000 mph.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 67 - 10:48:35 ]
RE: [DowellAlphaStudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] How should the wings be angled to create the least drag on an aircraft like ours?
For the low speeds that you will be working with the wings could be straight. Sweeping the wings back, could help you trim your model so it flies with less drag.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 69 - 10:50:54 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] when did you first become interested in aerospace stuff?
When I was about 9 or 10 years old. A long time ago.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 73 - 10:53:48 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] hand launched from about one story up.
If you are launching from 1 story up. I would try and build the model to glide as far as possible. That means the lighter the model is the farther it will go. If you build it light, you may have to be very gentle with the model during launch. Gentle toss rather than trying to hurl the model as you generally do with a paper airplane.

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 74 - 10:54:12 ]
Everyone, as Dale answers our final questions in the remaining minutes of our chat, we'd like to once again remind you to stop by our NASA QuestChat Information Center at http://quest.nasa.gov/qchats to send your comments to us.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 75 - 10:55:41 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] what exactally were you interested when you were 9&10
I wanted to be an astronaut. At that time, the only way to be an astronaut was to be a military pilot. I wanted to be a military pilot but it didn't happen. By then I was hooked on airplanes and made this my career.

[ Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool - 77 - 10:56:19 ]
Thank you very much for you answers to our questions! We enjoyed talking to you.

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 79 - 10:58:06 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] Thank you very much for you answers to our questions! We enjoyed talking to you.
We're glad you joined us today, Dowell students. Good luck with your aircraft design projects. We hope to hear form you online again in the near future!

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 80 - 10:58:11 ]
RE: [Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] what exactally were you interested when you were 9&10
You have to remember that when I was growing up the space program was just getting started. I was a small child during the early years of the space program and it was very exciting to think about being an astronaut. I still wish I could make a trip into space. When you guys are my age, you may be living in outer space.

[ DowellAlphaStudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool - 81 - 10:59:52 ]
By :)

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 82 - 11:00:09 ]
RE: [DowellAlphaStudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] Thank you for the information, it has been very helpful. When you say sweeping back, what do you mean?
Swept back wings mean that the wings don't stick straight out from the fuselage but instead are angled back. Look at a picture of a commercial transport aircraft for an example.

[ Dowellalphastudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool - 84 - 11:00:13 ]
:) :) :) :) :) :)

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 88 - 11:01:33 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] What was the first aircraft you rode in?
I think the first aircraft that I rode in was a twin engine Piper aircraft that held 6 passerngers maximum. It was my first year in college and we flew to Florida to see the Skylab launch.

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 90 - 11:01:48 ]
RE: [DowellAlphaStudents-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] By :)

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 91 - 11:02:24 ]
RE: [ChrisDavid/Faubion-ALPHA/McKinneyMiddleSchool] Hey we are David Miller and Chris Kelly David is going to be a pioneer in space colonization and Chris is going to be an Aerospace designer that wants to design mostly unusual looking aircraft. any comments?
Best wishes. Enjoy life.

[ ChrisDavid/Faubion - 92 - 11:04:03 ]
Enjoyed talking to you see you later. (hopefully)

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 93 - 11:04:11 ]
We will now be ending today's Aerospace Team Online chat with Dale Satran from NASA Ames Research Center. We would like to thank today's chatters for their great questions, and extend our thanks to Dale for sharing his time and career expertise with us online today. THANK YOU, Dale!

[ DaleSatran/ARC - 94 - 11:04:23 ]
Thanks everyone. Talk to you again.

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 95 - 11:04:56 ]
As a final reminder, visit our NASA QuestChat Information Center homepage at http://quest.nasa.gov/qchats to send your comments about today's chat to us.

[ Oran/NASAChatHost - 96 - 11:05:38 ]
An archive of today's chat will be available soon. Thank you again to everyone for joining us today. Have a great day!


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